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PostPosted: Mon Mar 22, '10, 11:20 pm 
First Let's get some quotes about Laya's people:

Quote:~I saw it with my own eyes. Miss Marlena brought some wilted flowers back to life.
~The power of the hero Orakio will protect you from Laia, Goddess of Darkness...
~Monsters have popped up out of nowhere around here lately, but... That's impossible! No monsters have appeared since 1,000 years ago, when Orakio defeated Laia..
~In this world, those called Orakians are people of light, and those called Laians are people of darkness. I've never seen a Laian myself, though.
~Laia's people wield mysterious powers. They use them to try to take over the world!
~I was accosted by one of Laia's people at the lake in the northeast forest! The girl never blinked - she HAS to be a Laian!
~They say that across the sea live people who worship the black witch Laia as a goddess.
~Have you even seen a Laian? They look just like us!
Man in House:
~The Laians attack us with monsters of their own creation, while we Orakians use ancient machines and robots to fight.
~Hey! Is it true that Orakians eat Laians?
~When I grow up, I'll become a big important magician, create lots of monsters, and wipe out those demons that worship Orakio!
~1,000 years ago, the goddess of love, Laia, was slain by your land's Orakio.
~~"Orakio's Law" forbids them from killing us directly.
Instead, they send their robots. Now, barring a miracle, they're poised to annihilate us.


That should help.. Now let me quote Japanese AYN to prove the origin of the cyborgs:

Now remember.. You can go from Aquatica - Aridia without gems

Quote:
~A-A report! A giant army of robots has appeared out of nowhere!
~Soldier: The robots are flying Orakio's colors and are invading our lands! Our armies of monsters are nearly annihilated!
~ It's horrible! As soon as you left, a new army of robots crossed the sea!
~The robots wanted to know how to use my Twins' Ruby...
~Ayn! Words can't express my gratitude. Use the Twins' Ruby Lann has! Long ago, I used that ruby to sneak into Riik's world...

In Flotraan

~"Satellite"? Ahh...headed for Satellite, are you? Don't you know? The marauding robot armies come from there!
~Townspeople (Children) : Our castle was taken over by robots who appeared out of nowhere...



Now to figure out the journey of the robots.. To do that you have to figure our Lyle's journey... Maybe it can help. Lyle did a hell of alot of journeying! I don't think this is right but from the japanese translation we have, i tried to put it together.

Lyle - all started cause he needed a Orakian descendant to fix the weather tower that the Lashute Sages screwed up to bring the Dev War back again. This caused Rhys and Lyle to open the doorways between the worlds and brought Siren/Lune back.

1)Aquatica - Aridia (via the 4 forts)
2)Steal the Twins Ruby in Haz
3)Landen - Steals Maia and makes his way back to Aquatica through Landen-Aridia-Aquatica
4)Lena frees Rhys and Rhys sets off
5)Lena follows Lyle and manages to make it to Aquatica and gets attacked by monsters
6)Lyle rescues her and carries her across the sea into the castle (An Agoean person relates this)
7)Lyle returns to Landen and sets up shop in the cave
8)He gives Rhys the Forest Saphire and takes off to Aridia (via his Twins Ruby)
9)Waits for Rhys inside the Weather Tower
10)Joins Rhys
11)Rest is history

I personally think Siren had access to the tunnels that NO ONE can use. He couldn't use the ones LUNE's soldiers guard.


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 22, '10, 11:34 pm 
Thoul wrote:But later, the character designer of the game revealed that there was an entire aspect of Thea's story as a wife and mother that wasn't covered in the game at all. Thea was very ill and weak for years, even to the extent that Mieu had to take over some duties as a caregiver for her son. Even a small mention of that in the game could have changed our perceptions of Queen Thea a lot.

Yes, one of the many "would have been nice to know" items that were left out of the final version of the game.

RW- Now that I've read your answer I'm beginning to think maybe it's not so bad that Laya-Younger would consider herself an important relic. And hmm... now I have an interesting idea for a story.

Your mustaches and harems comment cracked me up! It is, isn't it? It's like someone combined a Verdi opera with a dash-o-sci-fi.

I'm glad that not everyone sees the Alisa III as stuck in a patriarchy; thanks for all your insight, everyone! I'm kind of seeing the whole marriage and lineage issues as more individually circumstantial, after all, we only get a glimpse of three generations (well, unless you also count the older generation), so perhaps women aren't really taking a smaller role. Maybe it's out of necessity in some cases (if Thea was weak) and maybe it's part of the generic sprites.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, '10, 12:25 am 
Actually.. it's a small comic the character designer of Phantasy star 3 made.

Quote:In a doujinshi released by the character designer of PS3, Toyo Ozaki, the character Sean claims that Mieu was a surrogate mother to him and even * him because his mother, Thea, was sick (none of the other descendants of Rhys knew she had this function.) For some reason, she is also the only character in the game that can use the Grantz technique. The full extent of Mieu's functions is a


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, '10, 12:56 am 
A * robot, huh? Well, now I've heard it all. :lol:

Admittedly, I don't know much about what Toyo Ozaki has said or published, but the small amount that I have seen really brings more depth to the characters of PSIII.


Last edited by Tanith on Tue Mar 23, '10, 4:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, '10, 1:23 am 
Saligun in PSO episode 3 was a nursing android :D

Saligun just rocks all around, especially since she is the Hunter trainee instructor and is nigh unbeatable :D

http://www.pso-world.com/gallery/showph ... ?photo=307
http://www.pso-world.com/gallery/showph ... photo=3652

Does she remind you of anyone? :D


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, '10, 6:22 pm 
My views about the topic:

Quote:What do you think of the importance of marriage in the game? Is it simply a part of the generational tactic Sega used to garner interest in the game, or does it have deeper meaning to the people aboard the Alisa III?


I don't think it has a special meaning in the game, it was just the way to introduce a real role-playing aspect in an RPG (I don't know if there was something like that in previous RPG's), making the decision of the player radically change the gameplay. Of course, the marriage affects the life of the people in Alisa III, but, for example, if Rhys didn't marry either Maia or Lena, the facts would be more or less the same: Orakians and Layans had already make contact and peace. Eventually, someone else would surface as a hero to fight the Siren/Lune problem (depending on the generation you play).

Quote:Why are history and tradition seemingly almost entirely oral in this game, and why is it so secretive?


There are many theories of parallel oral traditions being kept on our society as well, though most fall on conspiracy theory genre. Usually traditions are oral when people don't have a writing system (unlikely for PSIII) or when it is not safe to put it on record. Remember that writing/recording information is made with the purpose of spreading it, so maybe the tradition should be kept secretive because there were lots of people willing to mess with Dark Force if they knew the truth, or to try to control the spaceship.

Quote:What has happened that would cause technology to be abandoned except for a few villages of important workers that keep the ship running?


Most certainly a collapse because of technology. When progress and technology can't prevent a society from collapse, people tend to blame the technology. The greatest example in Western history were the Middle Ages. Technology didn't prevent the fall of the Ancient Greek/Roman world, so people abandoned the large cities and technology in favor or a pastoral life under Feudalism. The spreading of Christian religion hastened it too. It is well-known that a lot of knowledge was lost at those times. The same may have happened to Alisa III after Orakio-Laya war and the same happened in Algo after PSII, with the collapse of Mother Brain (PSIV is much less advanced in technology than PSII).

Quote:Why do the women of Alisa III place so much of their self-worth on finding a suitable partner? Follow-up question: There's nothing to suggest in PSI or PSII that the people of Algo are a patriarchal society, so why has this society reverted to patriarchy, no matter if you're Layan or Orakian?


I don't know if they really do that (place their self-worth on finding a suitable partner), though most of monarchies, like in PSI, are patriarchal. PSII is another matter, because it is a sort of communism, which is the norm expected in a society were all the machines do the heavy work. Keep in mind that in times of great changes, it is not unusual to societies revert to past states, usually more conservative. When the hero marries a queen, he becomes the king. But when he doesn't, there is no indication that the man who married her became the king.

What bothers me about the politics and marriage in the game is, why should Rhys forfeit his claim to Landen throne to marry Maia? If he defeated King Cille, arguably he conquered Cille and should unite both crowns by marrying Maia.

Quote:Finally, (and this question was prompted by the mini discussion in RW's fan art thread) are Layans, particularly direct descendants and particularly females, more than just human? The original Laya was venerated as an almost god in the game, her sister has a blue aura (even years after she was woken from her cryogenic hibernation), Gwyn is clairvoyant, and Layans are the only ones who know how to use techniques. If you do not marry Laya-the-Younger in the second generation, she goes back to sleep. Did she consider herself an important relic rather than someone who could go on without marrying another royal? (What a sad existence, by the way.)


I don't think they really are more than "humans", just people who use techniques (arguably some Orakians may use techniques too, we just know that the Orakian heros can't). About Laya's sister, it is a bit strange, but most probably she is subject of Layan religion and she is a kind of a relic. That is why she was kept in cryogenic sleep and returns to sleep if you don't marry her (she stops being useful). If she is important by herself, this I don't know, but I believe not, I see her as a religion relic.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 23, '10, 6:49 pm 
Oh, that reminds me of something else I wanted to talk about regarding the secretive nature of the history and tradition! Did anyone else notice that Dark Force is actually mentioned twice in Rhys' quest? Even though no one in Landen knows they're on a dome ship, there is a legend there about the fight between Orakio and Dark Force. There's also a story about Dark Force and being the last survivors of a people in Rysel, the frozen town.

With those in mind, I think some of the history is not really secretive at all. It's just become so remove from the people's every day lives that it is regarded as mythical. For a real world parallel, consider Alexander the Great. Almost everyone knows of him and some of his accomplishments today, but we don't really give it much thought because it was so long ago.

Quote:What bothers me about the politics and marriage in the game is, why should Rhys forfeit his claim to Landen throne to marry Maia? If he defeated King Cille, arguably he conquered Cille and should unite both crowns by marrying Maia.


I agree. It never felt right to see Rhys to abandon Landen. It would have been hard for him to govern both areas, given the distance between them, but might have made great strides toward real peace between the Orakians and Layans.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, '10, 12:15 am 
Well you also have the fact that lots of women in ancient times were raised to marry certain princes and never met them.

I can quote two anime examples of this.

Princess Lover - Sylvia has been raised to be the heir to Arima's wife. She never met him till the series. Then she refuses to marry him unless he defeats her in battle. Later on in the series, Teppei rushes off to save Charlotte who was kidnapped choosing her over Sylvia. Right here we have a Rhys/Maia/Lena triangle.
Ikkitousen - Shoukyou - Introduced as the younger sister of Hakufu (which she is not) in the Great Guardians season going under the name Sonken Chuubou (Sun Quan) , but then tells them that her name is in fact Shoukyou. She is Shuuyu Koukin's destined wife. Hakufu was previously unaware of her existence. She appears to be very knowledgeable, as she quotes legendary military strategist Sun Tzu, (a bit of an irony since the Sun family was said to have descended from Sun Tzu) a great contrast to Hakufu who has trouble reading. It is implied that she might have feelings for "Koukin Onii-sama." Unlike her sister, Hakufu, Shoukyou is very polite, shy, and is very skilled at cooking. It is also pointed out by many characters in the series that Shoukyou doesn't look like her sister at all. She confesses her feelings for Koukin, but he turns her down gently and tells her to not let destiny rule her life; she accepts that very gracefully, also deducing Koukin's love for Hakufu. She joins Hakufu's fight with the real Saji, whom she bravely speaks to and helps get over her problems and traumas.

The Ikkitousen example can work for Lena letting Rhys marry Maia.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, '10, 1:00 pm 
Thoul wrote:Oh, that reminds me of something else I wanted to talk about regarding the secretive nature of the history and tradition! Did anyone else notice that Dark Force is actually mentioned twice in Rhys' quest? Even though no one in Landen knows they're on a dome ship, there is a legend there about the fight between Orakio and Dark Force. There's also a story about Dark Force and being the last survivors of a people in Rysel, the frozen town.

With those in mind, I think some of the history is not really secretive at all. It's just become so remove from the people's every day lives that it is regarded as mythical. For a real world parallel, consider Alexander the Great. Almost everyone knows of him and some of his accomplishments today, but we don't really give it much thought because it was so long ago.

This makes sense, because it's also mentioned at the beginning of Rhys's quest that people forgot there were lands besides Landen. After a thousand years of being cut off from traveling to the other domes and reverting to a medieval society, things like traveling through space probably seemed more like mythology to them. There weren't any important technical parts of the ship in Landen, and at least one person was scared of Mieu and saw her as evil, which shows a lack of understanding technology. In Lyle's case, he seemed to have more knowledge of the passages, the weather control and the moons, probably because they were more important to Aquatica than Landen.

I was also bothered that Rhys didn't unite the two kingdoms after marrying Maia. I'm guessing it had something to do with the gameplay and the team had to sort of write around what they already had in mind for the second generation.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, '10, 2:30 pm 
Of course the fact Rhys didn't keep both kingdoms has relation to gameplay, but also with the kind of meaning they wanted to give to the game. They wanted to make you confused who you were fighting against till the third generation, when you would see that neither the Orakians nor the Layans were evil, but both were fooled by Dark Force.

I think if Rhys' united both kingdoms, the only storyline possible would be renegade Layans not accepting that, so both Ayn and Nial storylines would be similar, fighting Layans. But what they wanted to do is to make the player think, at the beginning of the second generation that either the Layans were really evil (if you marry Lena) or that Orakians were the evil ones (if you marry Maia).


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